Episode 334: FLIR Sells Time: Thermal Imaging, Speed, and the Next Five Years with Peter Dekkers of FLIR

Episode notes

A firefighter sweeps a smoke-filled room. Every second of that sweep matters. Peter Dekkers of FLIR Systems explains how thermal imaging wins those seconds back.

Hello Smart Firefighting Community!

Welcome to another episode of covering real world innovations via interviews with fire service and technology industry experts that empower YOU to develop your very own Smart Firefighting strategy.

This conversation was recorded on the floor of Interschutz 2026 in Hannover .

The human eye cannot see through smoke. It cannot see in total darkness. It cannot read the temperature. A thermal camera does all three. Peter walks through FLIR's newest fire cameras, why training matters as much as the hardware, and where AI will take the thermal imager next.

Topics covered:

Why FLIR frames its cameras as time and speed, not spec sheets

The human limits a thermal camera overcomes: smoke, darkness, temperature

Removing the delay when a camera shifts between hot and cold zones

The K-series and the NFPA-compliant K85N

The upcoming K95 and its 95-degree field of view

Why FLIR does not experiment with firefighting products

The camera is only as good as the user: weekly training

VR training and the systematic room scan

Connected cameras and AI-guided decisions in the next five years

Peter's rule for work and life: you create your own conditions

So take a listen to hear what he has to share.

Head to www.smartfirefighting.com to discover how SFF accelerates innovation for emergency responders, to find out when our next event is, or review our curated resources.

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Chapters

1. 0:00 Interschutz mini-series intro
2. 0:34 Meet Peter Dekkers: features vs. what actually matters
3. 1:04 Saving lives and livelihoods as fires change
4. 1:49 The K-series and faster hot-to-cold shifts
5. 3:00 Why thermal imaging became a fire truck staple
6. 4:37 The camera is only as good as the user
7. 6:14 A new wide-view camera with a 95 degree field of view
8. 8:03 Why FLIR doesn't experiment on firefighting products
9. 8:29 What excites Peter at Interschutz: VR training
10. 10:31 Systematic room scans and building habits
11. 11:51 Peter's path to FLIR
12. 13:00 The next five years: connected cameras and AI guidance
13. 15:27 Words to live by: you create your own conditions

Questions answered in this episode

What does Peter Dekkers mean when he says FLIR sells time and speed?

Peter Dekkers says technology helps firefighters respond more quickly and save lives and livelihoods. Fires are becoming more intense with electric vehicles and different building materials, so eliminating even small delays matters when every second counts in a fire.

Hear it at 1:03

What technical improvement did FLIR make in the new K series cameras?

Peter Dekkers explains that the K series eliminates the slight delay when the camera shifts between high and low sensitivity as you move from hot to cold zones or vice versa. This lets firefighters do big scans without losing a human signature or hotspots, saving a few seconds.

Hear it at 1:58

What are the three human limitations thermal imaging helps firefighters overcome?

Peter Dekkers says humans cannot see through smoke, cannot see in total darkness, and cannot see temperature. A thermal imaging camera provides all three, helping firefighters make the right decisions based on what is in front of them.

Hear it at 3:14

What is the K95 camera and why is the field of view important?

The K95 has a 95 degree field of view, much wider than the typical 45 to 57 degrees. Peter Dekkers says this helps reduce the time spent scanning a room, letting firefighters get a single snapshot in split seconds and move on.

Hear it at 6:23

How does Peter Dekkers see AI changing thermal imaging cameras in the next five years?

He says AI will process the information the camera sees and help firefighters make the right decision, such as guidance on which direction to go or reminders to scan below tables. The camera will help with autonomous decision making so the firefighter can focus on other things.

Hear it at 13:45

Transcript

Machine transcript of the published audio. Names may be misspelled and some sections are missing.

[0:20] Kevin Sofen: All right, who am I here with today?

[0:22] Peter Dekkers: This is Peter, Peter Dekkers, FLIR Systems. Kevin.

[0:26] Kevin Sofen: Peter, it's good to re-meet you. All right, nice to see you again. You're one of my favorite people to talk to when it comes to fire tech and innovation. I'm gonna start right at it again. A quote that I say a lot when not necessarily talking about features and not talking about nuances, and you said it, you actually said the last time we were in [inaudible 0:40], is that, FLIR doesn't sell cameras. FLIR sells time, it FLIR sells speed. When you say that, give me more of the backstory and the meaning, why is that ring so true still today?

[1:03] Peter Dekkers: No, actually it's a very valid point because when we talk about firefighting, we talk about saving lives and livelihoods. We know how dangerous fire can be. Things are also changing, so you have electric vehicles, different building materials. Fires can be more intense. So a lot of dynamics are there. And we tend to forget how important technology can be to help firefighters to respond more quicker and saving life and livelihoods. And that's also something we are continuing to implement in our products.

[1:37] Kevin Sofen: Yeah, and obviously we see all these spec sheets and these spec sheets are great and it's important that it shows, but what matters is how can you help first responders save time and speed so they can get out themselves safer, but also accomplish the task and protect your saving life faster.

[1:58] Peter Dekkers: Yeah, so in our new K series, we reintroduced recently and also our new NFPA compliant K85N. have something which no other thermal imaging camera has for firefighting. Normally when you go from a hot to cold zone or vice versa, the camera is making a shift. We call that from high sensitivity to low sensitivity. There's always a slight delay. So we took that away completely. So that means that you as a firefighter can do very big scans without losing, let's say, a human signature or hotspots. So it may sound like a very insignificant change, but actually you will save a few seconds when you're sweeping a room and any second counts [inaudible 2:41] a fire.

[2:42] Kevin Sofen: Yeah, so from a high level perspective and someone that maybe is, I think most people know what infrared cameras are. And this was one of the great examples of an innovation where before they were very large and now it's almost expected that you have one on every vehicle. But when you think of an infrared camera and you think of this, what has this done for the fire service? And why has this become maybe one of the staples of just technology on the fire truck?

[3:14] Peter Dekkers: Yeah, so our eyes, our humans, we are limited so we can't see food smoke we can't see in total darkness and we can't see temperature we can't see how he won't something is and these three elements so see through smoke seeing in total darkness because in a lot of cases there's no fire or you have something at night is [inaudible 3:35] information for fire farther and temperature so if something is room temperature you're fine. If something is 300 degrees, you are in danger. So technology really helps you to overcome the human limitation. So without, I think you're limiting yourself very, very much as a firefighter. So it's really helping a firefighter to make right decisions based on what is in front of his or her.

[4:02] Kevin Sofen: And I think the infrared camera has helped penetrate the market in a way where there's still this a lot, at least I know in the American fire service, I'm curious in the rest of the world of like, this is the way we've always done it. So we're gonna keep doing this way. But now infrared cameras are now, again, this commonplace, you kind of just elaborated eloquently about some of the nuances about why these cameras help humans create a better advantage, but the cultural change, tell me about the cultural change that was needed to embrace this technology. And I'm curious your thoughts on how that hopefully can apply to other technology that's very thoughtful and purpose.

[4:49] Peter Dekkers: Yeah, so I think with, especially with the tech use, it's all about education. So we encourage firefighters to really take the use of a tech seriously. So because the camera is as good the user. So we encourage everybody to take proper training and you exercise it, make it part of your weekly or monthly training routine. If you're a career firefighter, do it. Also as a volunteer firefighter. So make it part of your training curriculum. No question about it, because there are so many benefits of using IR. Seeing through smoke, seeing in total darkness, knowing what temperature means, but it requires training. So we train everybody to really use it. I'm not taking out of the vehicle when there is something, but use it every week. Train it, train it, train it.

[5:41] Kevin Sofen: I know there's other competitors in the tick market and iron market, but when I think of FLIR, it's sort of like the Kleenex of this space. And I'm always interested, like obviously there's a dynamic of Moore's law, better, faster, smaller, cheaper. But what is FLIR doing that's continuously pushing the out? Like what's new? I'm always like curious about how you can possibly do more than what I see here. But what's, you mentioned the hot to cold nuance and that's maybe a software play within the hardware bike. What does it matter something new that FLIR is doing to push the envelope and innovation?

[6:23] Peter Dekkers: So that's a very good example. So here at the the interviews, we are showing a new camera, which we will be launching this fall in US. It's the much bigger field of view. So normally with any fire camera, yes, assertive field of yours between 45 5557 field of your'85 We have a new cameras called to the K 95. High resolution imager, is a very wild field of you, so if you're entering a building and you like to see if there are any persons left, and you see any pockets, we want to reduce the movement, so you can operate quicker. So we are introducing a wild field of your camera, which really helps you to get a single snapshot of a room. You can have a you can do it in a split seconds, scan the room and move on. So it's really talking about what you started talking about. Speed and time, it really helps to reduce the time spent on scanning a room. So that's something nobody else has. 95 degree field of view, we will be soon having more side by side. 95 degree field of view.

[7:30] Kevin Sofen: why more than 90? I mean, it seems like an interesting number. Why 95?

[7:35] Peter Dekkers: Oh, so basically we have a lot of it, cause we are an IR company, and we have a lot of kind of tuning experience in that particular field of view. So that's the reason we don't want, in firefighting you don't want to experiment. So that's the reason why we took a filter fuel, we are comfortable with, which works very well with our detectors. So that's the reason why we decided to go for the 95, because that's something we have implemented in some of our other products as well. As we again, we don't want to experiment with our firefighting products. Yeah.

[8:13] Kevin Sofen: It's like with the marathon, you don't want to try anything new on game day. You want to see, you know, using what you've already accustomed to.

[8:23] Peter Dekkers: Yeah, of course, of course. [inaudible 8:25] a tool. It's not only a tool to rescue people, but it's also a safety device for the firefighting inside the Berlin building. So we don't want to have the tool failing in you.

[8:37] Kevin Sofen: So we're at Interschutz 2026. Is there anything maybe not fully related? Is there anything as you've walked around that you've seen here, you're like, man, that's a unique technology. That's something that really has a place within helping the fire service save time. Save efficiencies, save reduced cancer exposure. Anything you've seen that has maybe kind of made you excited about some new technology for the fire service?

[9:06] Peter Dekkers: Yeah, actually about training. Because I see right now, VR training companies, you know, having high quality simulation software and training programs. like it because we also talk about the new generation of fire fighters, which may be a different background. We go up, it also will help them using the available tools such as an a tick to use it more effectively. And that is something which I didn't see four years ago at the last Interschutz. Right now we see more of these companies. Again, what I mentioned earlier, better the user restraints, the better the more the user, the fire fighter can get out of a tick. So I'm very pleased to see that also the training is involving and sure that the fire fighter can use the tool more effectively.

[9:58] Kevin Sofen: I know the VR narrative is that I think there's sometimes a concern that this is replacing training or replacing li-fire training, but it's more about how to get more sets and reps, how to continue to create opportunities to train on something, even though if it's maybe not the exact real thing, it's sort of allowing you to like, it doesn't need to be perfect. But if you as the trainer, and you have the student, if you're using a virtual thermal imaging camera, it allows you to ask the questions about, you know, why are you pointing it this way? Why is you, you know, from this, you know, again, area that's hot versus cold and starting to ask those questions. I'm curious as you approach training about how you can use VR to help, do you think you can use VR to help better train people to use thermal imaging cameras?

[10:54] Peter Dekkers: So very simple. So as an example, when you enter a room, you want to systematically scan the room. After we divide the view camera, less scanning is required, but you still need to run a certain sequence. And you have to make that an habit. So if you enter the building,you don't have to think. So you should automate it yourself. So you can train things like that. And maybe you can do one training day, you know, is more office. So you have more the theoretics and you do the VR training. And maybe the next week you go outside and burn some pallets and do the fire training. So basically it's all about also automated things. So when you have the camera,you know what to do with it. So you know, okay, I need to scan the corners, ceiling, things like that. So you need to automate things yourself. And if you do that, so you're less focused on, okay, how should I operate the camera? You know,you will work more efficiently. And I think VR helps with that. It's less costly. It can be done even if, yeah. If you don't have the camera. notice real. but you can kind of help people to train and to automate things as well. yeah.

[12:11] Kevin Sofen: I've probably asked this before but what was the Peter's story? How did you get, how did you start working with FLIR? Like what led you in your career before FLIR? What work did you do and then how did you end up at FLIR? [inaudible 12:26]

[12:26] Peter Dekkers: like technology and you have technology, I have technology. So I'm part of FLIR, so we do anything from very small cell phone level thermal imaging cameras to the most advanced defense type applications. And it's kind of an exploration for me as well to see what these thermal imaging can for you, how it can help advanced people. So it's actually maybe born more out of curiosity. Yeah, because it's not that when you're born as a child, you want to become a fireman or policeman. But let you start to discover more about what technologies there are and it's a fascinating world.

[13:06] Kevin Sofen: Yeah, and it can you the nice thing about the imaging we can see things.

[13:11] Peter Dekkers: People, the human eye cannot see and it makes it very special.

[13:15] Kevin Sofen: And I've asked you about this some capacity already in this conversation, but it's June 2026. What do you see as far as some of the next five years for FLIR as far as again, I'm always impressed with the amount of the size, the cost, the usability, but what do you see on from whatever you can share in the next five years that the fire service will hopefully benefit from some of the future FLIR and thermal imaging innovations?

[13:45] Peter Dekkers: Yeah, so no actually I think we are really at the beginning of a very big change in the firefighting world, also the tics. I think we already made the first step with the new generation cameras were being connected. So right now it has some functionality to manage data and so on. But the future will be that lot of the information seen by the thermal imager will be processed where AI can help you making that right decision. Like okay well don't go this direction, look around the corner, [inaudible 14:18] are many tables in the room, make sure that you get some kind of guidance at GPS. Like okay make sure that you scan every corner below the tables and so on. I think that AI really help the firefighter more efficiently. So I think technology will help so that the firefighter can maybe focus on slightly other things and then the camera will help making decisions with the firefighter. I think we are at the fore front. the camera is connected. but 5 years from now you will see a big step forward in autonomous decision making by the camera.

[14:55] Kevin Sofen: they have the right man at the job and leading the charge in you. final question, this is a random one. you are a wealth of knowledge and a lot of good insights. but within Peter Dekkers' daily life or your life with FLIR. do you have any favorite quotes or words of wisdom or any sort of inspirational quote that you live by? whether it is within your work that you do or something in your daily life?

[15:23] Peter Dekkers: yeah so actually that I learned from my first boss when I started my career after university. en is actually a very very cheesy one, but he always says you create your own conditions. So it's you should not help other people accountable for what you are today. So you're in control of yourself. So basically it says initiative and being proactive will help you. So don't blame others. So you're in control. So you create your own conditions. and I think it still applies to all of us today. and I always think back about what he said when I started my career.

[16:01] Kevin Sofen: yeah, the way I think about that is control what you can't control. and I like that you can create your own condition. so Peter, always a pleasure talking with you. thank you for everything you're doing and look forward to crossing paths again in some random city around the world.

[16:21] Peter Dekkers: okay good. sounds like a plan. thank you Kevin.

[16:24] Kevin Sofen: thanks Peter. take care.