Episode 266: Promoting Competency and Building Safety within Fire Engineering with Hayley Burgess

Episode notes

Here’s how to promote competency and safety in the fire sector:

Hello Smart Firefighting Community!

Welcome to another episode of covering real world innovations via interviews with fire service and technology industry experts that empower YOU to develop your very own Smart Firefighting strategy!

In this episode:

How the IFE supports fire professionals through exams, CPD, and knowledge sharing

The role of collaboration in addressing global challenges in fire engineering

Why continuous learning is key to adapting to new technologies and industry trends

Hear from Hayley Burgess - the International President of the Institution of Fire Engineers (IFE).

Hayley explores the organization's role in supporting fire professionals worldwide. She discusses how the IFE promotes competency through examinations, continuous professional development, and structured membership grades, ensuring that industry professionals are prepared for their critical roles.

The conversation highlights the power of collaboration and knowledge sharing, emphasizing how global challenges in fire engineering benefit from shared solutions and best practices. Hayley also shares her journey into the fire safety field, her passion for continuous learning, and the importance of staying adaptable in a field that evolves alongside new technologies and construction trends.

So take a listen to hear what she has to share!

Episode Resources:

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Chapters

1. 0:00 Intro from the IFE booth at AFAC 2024
2. 0:59 Hayley Burgess joins
3. 1:16 Why Hayley is at AFAC as IFE International President
4. 1:46 What the Institution of Fire Engineers does
5. 3:22 The Grenfell Tower phase two report and competency
6. 4:26 Fire safety from design to firefighting
7. 6:24 Keeping up with fast-moving fire engineering
8. 8:00 Emerging technology and continuous learning
9. 9:29 How Hayley got into fire
10. 11:18 IFE priorities for the next 6 to 12 months
11. 12:20 Who can join the IFE
12. 12:35 Every day is a school day
13. 13:46 Wrap

Questions answered in this episode

What is the Institute of Fire Engineers and who can join?

Hayley Burgess describes the Institution of Fire Engineers as a global body representing people working in the fire sector, not just fire engineers but anybody, including fire and rescue services, fire safety consultants, and fire risk assessors. You do not have to be a fire engineer to join; you just have to have an interest in fire.

Hear it at 1:58

How does the IFE promote competency in fire safety?

The IFE promotes competency through education and continuing professional development. Hayley Burgess says the organization offers examinations, CPD, and registration schemes, including through the engineering council and the fire risk assessors register. They were the first professional engineering institution to get registration with the HRRB.

Hear it at 3:22

What new fire hazards are emerging in modern construction?

Hayley Burgess mentions lithium-ion battery fires, electric vehicles, electric scooters, hoverboards, and incorrectly discarded household batteries leading to recycling plant fires. Modern methods of construction, lightweight materials, solar panels, and the push to build quicker and cheaper also present new challenges.

Hear it at 6:24

Why does the IFE emphasize collaboration across the fire sector?

Hayley Burgess says the fire sector cannot operate as an island. Sharing knowledge between designers, architects, construction people, and professional organizations in different countries is key because everyone is experiencing the same problems, and collaboration ensures solutions are available to all.

Hear it at 8:24

What is Hayley Burgess's advice on learning in fire safety?

Her quote is every day is a school day. She says never stop learning, never think you know it all, and never become complacent because complacency breeds contempt.

Hear it at 12:56

Transcript

Machine transcript of the published audio. Names may be misspelled and some sections are missing.

Ep 266 transcript

Promoting Competency and Building Safety within Fire Engineering with Hayley Burgess

Speakers: Kevin Sofen, Hayley Burgess

Source: Whisper medium.en machine transcription of the published Podbean audio (no original transcript found in Drive), lightly cleaned. Speakers were separated by voice clustering and then checked and assigned by hand at every speaker change. Gaps where the model returned no usable text are marked [inaudible m:ss].

[0:00] Kevin Sofen: Welcome to a mini Smart Firefighting podcast series, recorded live at the Institute of Fire Engineers booth during the 2024 AFAC Show Down Under in Sydney, Australia. Throughout these conversations, we dive into critical issues like fire safety, emerging technologies, diversity in the fire service, and innovative solutions for emergency response. with these fascinating insights from leaders around the world on how we can build a safer and more resilient future. Hayley Burgess, the international president of the Institute of Fire Engineers, discusses how the organization promotes competency through exams and continuous development. She also emphasizes the role of global collaboration in addressing fire engineering challenges in her passion for continuous learning. I think it's podcasts 14 or 15 of the IFE miniseries alongside Hayley Burgess here in the little IFE hut. Hayley, how you doing?

[0:59] Hayley Burgess: I'm very good, thank you Kevin, how's you?

[1:01] Kevin Sofen: Life is good. I was on a fire truck this morning with New South Wales and went on two calls and saw a little behind the scenes, a day in the life of a firefighter here and it was really special and eye-opening experience.

[1:13] Hayley Burgess: I was gonna say, that would be very interesting. I'd love to do that.

[1:16] Kevin Sofen: Yeah, so what brings you to AFAC? Why are you here and what have you been working on here?

[1:21] Hayley Burgess: I'm here in my role as International President for the Institution of Fire Engineers. I was elected last October, and it runs to this October, so I'm here in that role. I'm doing a few workshops involved in a few panels. I was involved in one the other day on the Coalition for Change for PPE for Ladies, which was great fun, very enlightening. Today, I'm doing another workshop with Angela.

[1:46] Kevin Sofen: Okay, and you mentioned your role within the IFE. Tell me about kind of the Institute of Fire Engineers. In your words, what is the Institute of Fire Engineers? And ultimately, how did you get into your position today?

[1:58] Hayley Burgess: That's a good question. So the Institution of Fire Engineers is obviously a global international body that represents people working in the fire sectors, not just fire engineers, but anybody. So I'm not a fire engineer technically, I'm a fire risk assessor or fire safety consultant. So it represents fire and rescue services, fire engineers, fire safety people working within the fire sector. We provide professional support in the form of examinations, CPD, stuff like that. We also provide membership grades as well. So yeah, how did I get here? I was on the board. this is my third year of being on the board. And last year I was elected as international president, which has been a fantastic opportunity. I've been able, had the opportunity to travel the world really, right from Dublin to Puerto Rico to here to America so it's been a very busy year it's been fantastic actually.

[2:56] Kevin Sofen: Yeah well it seems like IFE is sort of like a little bit of a Swiss Army knife working on a couple different programs and initiatives and helping the other day we saw 26 fire engineers go into a training ground and experience what it's like to actually be a firefighter it's experience what it's like to put on PPE and what it's like to carry hose what are some other programs that IFE is doing? What's some of these programs and initiatives that you're involved with?

[3:22] Hayley Burgess: Well, you're probably aware that the Grenfell Tower phase two report came out yesterday. So the IFE will be analyzing that very carefully to see what's coming out of that. But one of the major projects that we're working on is obviously promotion of competency within the industry. So obviously competency in the fire safety industry is crucial. So, it's really important to us that our members remain to the forefront of all the developments, that they're equipped to fulfil their roles within the sector. So education and continuing professional development is one thing that we work very hard on. I would say the IFE is a leader in the CPD that we offer, the registration schemes. So we offer registration through the engineering council, we have our fire risk assessors register, We were the first professional engineering institution to get registration with the HRRB, when I'm contextualized register. So our members are at the forefront of developing their competency and that's ultimately what makes what's going to make buildings safer for everybody.

[4:26] Kevin Sofen: Well today when I was at the fire station I asked a couple of the firefighters and one in particular I was like is there any particular call or a most memorable call that comes to of mine and he was like there wasn't really one that was like a big call or a bad call but it was more about when they operated and followed the protocol perfectly and when they just did everything as properly and as correctly as possible and it kind of speaks to having sound practices and sound protocols and in following through on them as a collective unit whether it's on the firefighting side or the fire engineering side to have the best

[5:00] Hayley Burgess: outcomes yeah absolutely would agree with that and you know it's the same from the initial design stages of a building right through to the actual maintenance of a building it's making sure that the building's designed to the correct code to the correct standards and even after the buildings constructed that's obviously not the end of it because the building has to be maintained you know somebody can design a building so that it's it's designed to operate perfectly but if we don't if we don't educate the people in the building we don't maintain the systems for fire safety in the building, then when something happens it's all going to go pear-shaped. So yeah that's that's absolutely spot on I would say.

[5:40] Kevin Sofen: It seems like within the dynamic of fire engineering in the building construction it's important to note that trends have changed from over time when thinking about I know within the North American market in particular with the introduction of lightweight construction materials and kind of quickly made furniture stuff burns faster, it burns farther. In addition to that, there's challenges of lithium-ion batteries, power storage, there's challenges of solar panels on roofs, there are all these unknown challenges. I would love to hear some of your continuing dots on that of these different new threats that exist now that maybe didn't exist five, ten years ago and how does that impact both the fire engineering and fire response perspective?

[6:24] Hayley Burgess: Yeah so you know fire engineering is a very fast-moving world. As you say there's never a day goes by now that there's not some sort of lithium-ion battery fire in the news. Even our mode of transport electric vehicles are taking over the world. I suppose in my opinion electric vehicles yes I can see the environmental benefits but have we done enough research into what happens when they go on fire etc. We've had a number of incidents in the UK with electric scooters or hoverboards, those sort of appliances. I suppose one of the things we need to do is educate the public as well as to the dangers. Even a small thing of discarding batteries, ordinary household domestic batteries incorrectly are leading to recycling, plant fires, etc. But yeah, the way we build buildings has changed over the last years dramatically. We've got our modern methods of construction. I suppose the end goal is to build quicker, to build cheaper, to build more efficiently. energy efficiency, et cetera. So the solar panels, et cetera. But as you say, with those comes the challenges. So it's just getting the research in to know how we control these fires, how we prevent them. So there's an awful lot to learn. I suppose going forward, that's, that's not going to change. You know, we're going to keep looking for better methods of constructing buildings that can go up quicker, can go up higher. So yeah, it's, it's just, It's going to be an ongoing challenge for the whole fire sector and that's why we need to keep ahead of, you know, our learning, our knowledge up to date, figuring out all these new things.

[8:00] Kevin Sofen: It seems like there's these emerging technologies and just evolving trends that exist which requires a need for different, likewise, innovative approaches about how we design, how we respond, and then kind of coming back to the IFE perspective from leading some of these innovative approaches and leading the conversation about learning best practices, you know, how is IFE involved in helping this conversation?

[8:24] Hayley Burgess: One of the major things that we have to recognize is we, you know, the IFE or the fire sector, we can't operate as an island. Collaboration is the key to it. So by sharing our knowledge between designers, architects, construction people, you know, there's no point in us identifying a problem and putting a solution but not sharing that Because no matter where you go in the world, we're all experiencing the same problems. And sometimes you only see that when you sit down and for example, the forum I was in the other day, there was representation from six different countries and there wasn't one problem that we weren't all having. So I think it's about, it's about collaborating and ensuring the knowledge is shared, ensuring the problems are shared and how we're, how we're approaching to fix those problems. So I think sharing knowledge is key. collaboration with other professional organizations, making sure that our findings are available to all those other organizations, and vice versa, you know, it's a two-way street. So I think that's the way forward, not to sort of operate as an island alone.

[9:29] Kevin Sofen: At the beginning, you mentioned some of the dynamic and how you got into this role, but, you know, being in this for a couple of years now, what do you love about the fire engineering space, the IFE, and what you do for a career?

[9:41] Hayley Burgess: Well, believe it or not, But fire was never really on my radar as a career. When I was at school, my dream job was to be a vet, so a million miles away from fire. But I went to university, I didn't get the grades for veterinary, so I decided to study pharmacy. I hated pharmacy, so I did one year and then I moved into a general. science degree and following that I moved into retail management where I got my first experience of health and safety. So I sort of continued my career down the line of health and safety and that's where I discovered an interest in fire safety. The two sort of go hand in hand and then I went sort of focused more in the road of fire safety and for me fire safety was a mix of science which I love but it was there's a bit of excitement to You know, health and safety can be a wee bit sort of dull maybe at times to people. But fire is always exciting. There's a bit of excitement about it. I suppose I love my job because I get to see so many different scenarios, so many different people. No day is the same. Every day is different challenges, different projects to work on, different places to go. So it's the variety of the day-to-day job. Even within fire, there's so many different roads you can take within that. And for me, you know, the opportunities are never-ending, there's something to look forward to every day, whether it be sitting in an office, whether it be out in the road, whether it be in Australia. So yeah, it's a variety, the ability to meet people, the exciting developments, you know, there's no time to get bored. Let's put it that way.

[11:14] Kevin Sofen: No, plenty to do.

[11:16] Hayley Burgess: No, never get bored.

[11:18] Kevin Sofen: And as far as it's September 2024, what are some other like, in the next 6-12 months from IFE related you'd mentioned that the Grenfell report the second dynamic report coming out that's going to be a big focus. What are some other top priorities for IFE over the next couple months?

[11:37] Hayley Burgess: Gosh well I suppose we're focusing again on the competency element which is coming out of the Grenfell tower report but developing our contextualized registers for HRRBs your high-rise risk buildings and residential buildings expanding our membership expanding our offering to our members, ensuring that they're being equipped with the skills, the knowledge to deal with all these changes as we've spoken about, to deal with all the technological changes, the methods of construction. So just staying ahead of the curve really. I'm off to New Zealand next month to fire NZ. So again, it'll be just spreading the word about the IFE, making sure everybody knows where we're going, what we're doing.

[12:20] Kevin Sofen: And do you have to be a fire engineer to be part of IFE?

[12:24] Hayley Burgess: No, you do not. No, you just have to have an interest in fire. There's grades open to any person, you know, from whether you have an interest in fire right up to chartered engineers.

[12:35] Kevin Sofen: Yeah. And so this wasn't a question that was on the document that we talked through. But one thing I've been asking kind of people towards the end of the podcast is if there's a quote or words of wisdom that you live by or that you structure your vision with IFE around that is a kind of a backbone of how you operate and how IFE operates?

[12:56] Hayley Burgess: Goodness, that's a good question. I would say a quote that I go by is every day is a school day. Never stop learning, never think you know it all because you know very little to be honest. And I always expect the unexpected. That's sort of the two quotes that would sum up my days anyway.

[13:13] Kevin Sofen: Nowadays I love school and I love learning so I would agree with that. If I was in third grade and you told me every day is a school day, I'd be like, no, that's terrible.

[13:22] Hayley Burgess: Yeah, it's a cliche, but you know, everybody say, oh, school's the best days of your life. I don't know. I think university was best days of my life, I would say. But I can understand now what they're saying every day is a school day means.

[13:35] Kevin Sofen: Always be learning.

[13:36] Hayley Burgess: You know, never become complacent. I suppose there's a lot of people out there have become complacent and that's when things happen. Yeah. Complacency breeds contempt.

[13:46] Kevin Sofen: Right on. Well, Hayley, I really appreciate all the leadership that you're doing with IFE and continue to drive fire safety and fire engineering safety around the world and excited to continue to follow suit and see what's next for you and IFE.

[13:57] Hayley Burgess: Thank you very much. Thanks for having me, Kevin. Thank you.

[14:01] Kevin Sofen: Appreciate it. Thanks for listening to this episode recorded alongside the Institute of Fire Engineers during the AFAC Show. If you found value in the conversation or learned something new, we'd love to hear from you. share your thoughts, and let's keep the discussion going on how we can shape the future of smart firefighting.